THE BAIT
Access Genealogy - A Free Genealogy Resource

I WILL PRESENT MY OWN FILES!
THERE IS ONLY ONE INTERNET AND MY FILES ARE ALREADY THERE!

I maintain that ANCESTRY.COM (The Generations Network) does NOT have a right to determine the fate of files that belong to other people. Copyright issues are a matter of law and the files on the Internet can be fought about in court on a file by file basis.

ETHICS on the Internet is every bit as important as LEGALITIES. I would not take a paper clip that didn't belong to me... and it is maddening that someone would TAKE something from me. - No person with integrity and values would copy and post things that someone else spent time, money and effort on, often for many years. - This is about RESPECT and COMMON DECENCY.

The motto of my work is "A SERVICE, NOT A BUSINESS." In contrast, the motto of Ancestry.com/THE GENERATIONS NETWORK is all about exploiting the poor and unsuspecting, including MINOR children, in order to make a profit.

YES. If you come across the names, addresses and telephone numbers of your minor children or grandchildren on Ancestry.com, don't expect them to remove them from their "public documents" because they will NOT... under any circumstances. They do not reveal which "public document" they got the info from but it has to be from a business, like an insurance company.

I am nearly sixty years old and I have a life to live. To waste my time and energy being outraged takes me away from the priorities in my life. IT IS SIMPLY NOT WORTH IT! - And if I were to change the URLs of my sites, it would be a terrible inconvenience to too many people.

Since I am an idealist, I believe that in the end, PEOPLE ARE HELD ACCOUNTABLE FOR THEIR MISDEEDS. I hope that will hold true for the crew at THE GENERATIONS NETWORK, whom I consider completely unscrupulous!

I have received hundreds of emails but this is a good one: "If the internet were an ocean, Ancestry would be JAWS, gobbling up everything in its path..."

I CANCELED my subscription to Ancestry.com and promptly signed up with FOOTNOTE, a partnership of the LATTER DAY SAINTS CHURCH, the NATIONAL ARCHIVES and the ALLEN COUNTY PUBLIC LIBRARY. I will take my chances with them!

TIME TO MOVE ON! -- I only hope the public will SPEAK in any way they can to STOP all unethical - and illegal - conduct on the Internet.

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COMMENTS

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Anonymous Says:
September 2nd, 2007 at 4:59 pm

I am sorry to hear about all of these problems Rootsweb and Ancestry.com and want to thank you for all you have done in the name of genealogy.

I have had problems with Rootsweb in the past. I was very unsuspecting, when I gave family information to a distant relative. He wasn’t careful and had input some inaccurate information into his database. When he found out that he was dying, he donated all of his information to Rootsweb. It wasn’t until after he passed away, that I found the false information and contacted Rootsweb to get it corrected.

They came back with the reply that only the deceased could correct the data. LOL Then they replied that the direct people involved had to contact them - only after I informed Rootsweb, that they would probably sue Rootsweb. These elderly couple were in poor health and I was sure that at least one of them would have have a heart attack or stroke when they found out. Both of them and I survived this ordeal - but Rootsweb considered the information that had been given as their own, not even wanting to correct it. They finally made a note in an obscure location for part of the correction.

I know that it is difficult to take - but you are right, everyone does have to account for their own actions. It just doesn’t make it any easier right now.

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Jane Says:
September 2nd, 2007 at 11:28 pm

Time to move on, but will THE GENERATIONS NETWORK be held accountable?

THE GENERATIONS NETWORK owns for-profit genealogy web sites. For more than a year its roving MyFamily bot quietly cached millions of pages from others’ genealogy web sites for what became its Internet Biographical Collection. Launched at Ancestry.com on August 28, immediate public outcry contributed to TGN’s decision to permanently remove it on August 31.

Others’ research, others’ time, others’ effort, others’ money had been whisked by the bot into the anticipated coffers of The Generations Network betraying the trust of countless unsuspecting individuals.

How are one, two, three, four, or five decades of others’ dedication to pursuing ancestors calculated? What about the thousands spent as individuals – millions collectively – to assemble copyrighted research NOW IN THE HANDS OF THE GENERATIONS NETWORK?

With The Generation Network’s overreaching grasp – and its Internet Biographical Collection quickly hidden from view — for those who demand it, what is the PROCEDURE and GUARANTEE THAT CACHED WEB PAGES WILL BE DESTROYED and NOT cunningly gleaned to be incorporated within Ancestry.com or its affiliates as a multi-million dollar “bonus” from an unwilling public?

Veteran Researcher

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Linda Says:
September 3rd, 2007 at 6:09 am

we are moving on to continue our work to prevent this from happening again. We are in great need of INTERNET ETIQUETTE and the rotten apples need to be sorted out.

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Linda Says:
September 3rd, 2007 at 8:51 am

Someone sent me various blogs to read more about this controversary …but I don’t see the argument framed properly.

One compares this Ancestry situation with a copyright infringement lawsuit against Google for caching files.

The HUGE difference is that Google does not keep the files for the duration, NOR do they say what ANNA FECHTER said - - that Ancestry is keeping the files to preserve history - and if an owner takes down a site, Ancestry will still have the info to present via the cached files.

Another blog simply lectures about the responsibilities the website owners have to protect their own work. Such as, KNOW the “Fair Use” policy of Ancestry.com for the files stored on its Rootsweb server.

That is all well and good - but FIRST of all, Ancestry took files from the entire Internet, not just those on their own servers!

And the USGenWeb Project was hosted by Rootsweb BEFORE it was bought by Ancestry and we were PROMISED that our files would not fall under the “Free Use.” At this moment, the files from Rootsweb are STILL accessible on the Rootsweb server.

And the “Internet Biographical Collection” includes far more than biographies! It includes nearly everything under the sun!

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Anonymous Says:
September 4th, 2007 at 5:41 am

The anguish you feel must be enormous!

The pain Ancestry caused could have been avoided with an invitation to participate in the “preservation of history” project.

Ancestry has subscribers’ e-mail addresses, home addresses, phone numbers, an online newsletter and a magazine–and could have reached more people through newspapers and its other internet sites.

“Grabbing” websites and leaving heartbroken people is not okay!

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IBC is dead and gone! Says:

Obviously, you have too much time on your hands.

I don’t approve of what Ancestry tried to do, but it was not illegal. Why don’t you tell people the IBC is GONE? and it was free??

Every IBC entry could also be found with any search engine. Why aren’t you complaining about them?

Where you get the nerve to call the information you DONATED to USGenweb your “copywrite” material is beyond me. You are the only “coordinator” making a big deal of it. Rootsweb hosts USGenweb, not you.

Being a coordinator does not mean the data belongs to you. You gave it away!

I also did transcriptions for USGenweb. They belong to USGenweb now, not me.

Your www.lindapages.com claims ownership of West Virginia Genweb pages. Get real! All you did was transcribe records and books for them. Nice of you to do, but you did not write what you transcribed, nor do you hold rights to your transcription.t the various sites you claim.\ to own.

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Linda Says:
September 4th, 2007 at 12:56 pm

Obviously, you are misinformed… and also too much of a coward to leave a name. You must be a hired gun — the annoying SeaGulls person from the Ancestry Board?

And it is COPYRIGHT, not COPYWRITE. I hold 5 copyrights from the Library of Congress and evidently you don’t know anything about the subject. (And did you see the post on the Ancestry Board from the copyright attorney? Sounds like you are full of shit!)

#1, as I have stated, we can debate the legalities item by item and page by page. The IBC has been removed “for the time being” but they still have my GenWeb files on Ancestry.com

To me, this is not as much about legalities as it is about what is RIGHT. I would not take anything WITHOUT PERMISSION that someone else spent years compiling, BUYING, typing, etc.

At first the IBC was NOT free - the "free" access was only instituted AFTER the initial public outcry.

I wrote this message to Anna Fechter, the person in charge of the ill-fated IBC:

Hello, Anna:

While you say the “Internet Biographical Collection” is not accessible, you have not stated that you have deleted the cached files, nor that you won’t find another way to use them.

My initial outrage was related to the many thousands of ORIGINAL images, bios, html-authored pages, etc. IN MY OWN DOMAIN.

You say, “We cached individual Web pages in an effort to preserve history - if a Web page featuring important family history information were taken down in the future, a cached version would still be available.” As if you hve the right to determine the fate of files that DO NOT belong to you.

However, I see that they are not being used, as you have said, “for the time being.”

BUT my files from my GenWeb sites ARE on Ancestry.com - AT THIS MOMENT.

This raises this question in my mind: Are you going to take the cached files, harvested for the “Internet Genealogical Collection,” and simply incorporate them into other collections - under different names?

Just so you get the picture of what I am saying about the GenWeb files being on your Ancestry.com site, try this:

Go to Ancestry.com

Type in Nettie Atkinson

On the Historical Records result, click “United States Obituary Collection”

Look on the list until you see William Grant Cunningham - click that

When the page comes up, click “View full obituary.”

That is my “C” obituary file for my Marshall County site. It is no doubt the same for all. I have not looked at the extent to which my GenWeb files are there but they should have NONE. I have not donated anything to Ancestry.com

Another thing is that the “United States Obituary Collection” is a MESS. In the example I gave you, you can see that she died 60+ years ago and the obit was in the Wheeling paper. Yet this is what the Ancestry,com thing says:

Newspaper Title: Wilson County News, The
Newspaper Location: Floresville, TX, Us
Obituary Publication Date: 13 Apr 2004

Reply from Anna Fechter (which clearly shows (1) she did not read my message or (2) she didn't understand it):

Linda, The record you are referring to is found in an obituary collection, and is not part of the Internet Biographical Collection. I also want to pass along information that I sent out earlier today, "The collection is not accessible or searchable. We have worked to make sure that any cached pages have been removed and are not accessible, even if trying to go back to them with a saved URL. If you or your members find that there are cached pages that you can still access, please first try clearing the internet cache on your computer. If you can still access the cached page after that, please provide us with the URL so that we can look into the issue further and resolve the error." We are working to ensure that any of the pages that had been viewable via the IBC are fully removed from our site. If there is anything further I can assist you with please reply. Sincerely, Anna Fechter Community Operations Manager

Reply to Anna from Linda:

Sadly, it is evident that you did not READ my message. One of my points is that I KNOW the file I referenced is not in the IBC. I SEE that! That is the point!

You say you removed the IBC but did you DELETE the cached files? And why are CACHED files of my sites showing up in collections, such as the obituary collection? It goes to my websites - and is a cached file just like the IBC

SO WHY ARE MY PAGES IN ANY COLLECTION?

And did you catch the part about the mess of the US obit collection?

Rely from Anna Fechter: NONE (as of Sept 7, 2007)

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Amanuensis Says:
September 4th, 2007 at 1:42 pm

Linda, you have repeatedly said that you would take nothing that does not belong to you. But by your repeated slandering of Ancestry.com, you have taken their good name! Over and over, in a variety of places, you have accused Ancestry of STEALING from you, in other words, perpetrating a criminal offense. I believe that what Ancestry has done is entirely legal and ethical. Other people believe it is not, but at worst, it is infringing on copyrights, which is not stealing. “Stealing” has precise legal definitions in each of the fifty states. A person’s First Amendment right to Free Expression does not mean that they have the right to yell Fire in a theatre, unless of course there is a fire there — and there is not a fire here.

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Linda Says:
September 4th, 2007 at 1:50 pm

Nameless person:

I don’t care what you think but you are entitled to your own view. Start a blog and see how many people you can convince that they didn’t take and keep files belonging to other people from all over the Internet!

I am exercising my constitutionally protected rights and you are entitled to do the same.

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JoAnne Says:
September 5th, 2007 at 7:41 pm

I found my son's entire family in the Ancestry.com public records. Where did they get them? The age of my son and his wife is there and the names of all of the children + plus their address and phone. And their phone number is not published in the phone book. Can they do that? What if child predators find these lists and learn about the whole family? I'm sick.

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Linda Says:
September 4th, 2007 at 8:50 pm

I don't know JoAnne but it is very upsetting. I found my son's family listed, as well as my own, and I can't imagine any public record that gives our ages. My phone number is not there but my son's is.

It seems like "public records" is a term that is used very casually. One example is that people have posted ADOPTION information about living people. Some people choose not to be contacted by biological parents and they do not want their information online. In one case, a family website posted information about a young woman, unbeknownst to her, which included her birthdate, the fact that she was adopted, and the hospital where she was born. A Google search with the date, "adoption," and the hospital, immediately brought up the identity of the woman on the Family Genealogy site. So she could have been found easily by the biological parents. - The family site argued vehemently for 6 months about this, claiming the adoption was a "public record." IN FACT, it is NOT a public record. In some states adoption records are SEALED! In some states the ADOPTEE cannot even get the information.

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NK says:
September 6th, 2007 at 11:00 pm

You are right about how big ancestry.com is. On manta.com, a public website, Ancestry.com's annual sale/revenues are listed as

$140,259,000.

Wow! Thanks for your statements/comments on your website/pages. It is great to see someone that is willing to be outspoken. Thanks again. A fellow researcher and someone who has glanced at your West Virginia pages from time to time.

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Linda Says:
September 7th, 2007 at 1:00 pm

For those who don't like me, they will be happy to know that I AM DEAD!

YES, I just saw this on ANCESTRY.COM! Evidently, I died in 1997 in Florida. Someone I have never heard of posted that information about me in her genealogy file!

I posted this on the Ancestry.com Message Board:

I thought I had a bad week with Ancestry.com, as a result of cached files that are still on the site, but I didn't realize until today how bad it was!

It came as a quite shock to me to see that I died in 1997 in Florida.

Someone I do not know (emileelc7) and have never heard of, has me (and my living husband) in her genealogy file with ERRONEOUS information. Obviously, I am not dead!

Name: Linda Lee Cunningham
John W " Cunningham & Ruth Essie " Smith
Birth Date: 1948
Birth Place: West Virginia USA
Death Date: 1997
Death Place: Florida USA

NEVER should living people be in those files.

I have written to both the poster and to Ancestry.com and we will see if I have to wait 2 years to get the information removed.

The submitter, Emilee, is trying to edit or remove the file which states that I am dead. I no longer see the Ahnentafel file but of course there is still the FAMILY TREE. Is this a CACHED file that will still be around long after I AM gone?

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I noticed this on the Ancestry.com site: "Why are there no census records after 1930?" - To protect the privacy of living persons who may appear in the censuses, The government requires a 72-year waiting period from the year a census is taken before it can be released. For this reason, the 1940 census will not be made available until the year 2012.

This is common knowledge, of course, but isn't it ironic to find this on the Ancestry.com site?

Ancestry.com should take a lesson from the Federal government - or from me, because I don't post info about the living for at least 70 years.

Maybe they could start with removing the names, addresses and phone numbers of minor children from the "Public Records" database.

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